First off, mods if this violates any rules, feel free to delete. But here goes,
After a day of release of On the street, I have mixed feelings about this song. Since Cole is my partner’s fav artist I waited until we both could listen to it together. Till then, I lurked this sub and read what you’ll had to say about it. And you’ll were loving it so I had high hopes. When I finally listened to it, cole’s verse took me by surprise. First, the calling people who don’t believe in god, stupid and second, swearing.. Honestly, swearing I can look past. But trying to force your belief in to other people is not something I’m cool with. I’m all for people’s choices but why call people who don’t believe in what you believe in, stupid.
I asked my partner (a long time Cole fan) if it’s just lyrics or if he’s really into the faith and from what my partner said, he was brought up in the faith. As an atheist, my partner said he separates the person from their work.
Maybe it’s the spoilt army in me, but I’m used to being loved, adored and respected by the artists I support. They literally have multiple songs for us and constantly acknowledge how their success is correlated with army.
On the other hand, you have this other artist who openly calls his non-god-believing fans stupid… Honestly I’m so so happy for Hobi that he got to collab with his muse that he looked up to for so long but I don’t think I can openly support someone who doesn’t respect other people. Of course this is how I feel and I’m sure others will have different ways of perceiving things.. but sigh, rant over.
Edit: on a much simpler note, saw this meme and [props to the stupid friend lol](https://twitter.com/andfuckvmin/status/1631737074100436992?s=21)
by underwearhoneyboyy
![230729 [SUCHWITA] EP.15 SUGA with Jungkook](https://www.btshubs.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/1692496262_643_3OTJcupo4FLHwqKh-9hK9-sjaD7gUbZhhGNhQXeGHjg.jpg)
Before I say anything else, I thought JHope was wonderful and beautiful in this MV, I really loved him and I couldn’t stop smiling while watching him. But, I had a few struggles with this song too. I found it to be a little abrasive like you said and it did catch me a bit off guard. Also, I have a complaint too: the J. Cole to Hobi ratio felt way off. I love that they got to work together to create this, it’s really meaningful, but definitely not enough Hobi.
I’m personally not too bothered by it but it’s probably because I haven’t really digested J Cole’s lyrics. I suck at really getting into rap lyrics anyway. They tend to be too poetic for me. But that’s just me.
It’s alright if you don’t like it because there’s a part that really affects you. You should be able to do what you feel is right for you.
I need to read Cole’s lyrics over, but i did want to let you know, OP, thank you for being brave to post this. I can read how much you wanted to love this, I can see how many perspectives you tried to take.
Regardless of how I feel about your post, i’m happy you felt safe enough to share here. 💜
I agree with you, honestly the lyrics didn’t really register the first time I listened to it but I feel like I get more annoyed the more I think about it lol.
I thought it was really funny when someone in the main kpop sub said he didn’t actually mean he thinks non-religious people are stupid. Like… Okay but he did say That. Like verbatim lmao.
And then someone else said it had to be taken in context with the rest of the verse and. Again. Okay. The rest of the verse where he specifies that his “friend” is stupid because they don’t attribute the wonder and beauty of the universe to a higher power? The rest of the verse that doesn’t change the meaning at all??
I’ve been trying not to think about it and I limited myself to one comment in that thread because I’m a ~thirty one year old laaadyyy~ and don’t need to get into the wank but judging from my wall of text I apparently also needed to rant lmao.
And to reiterate what I said in the original thread, I do actually really like the vibe of the song, and am looking forward to the hope-only version so this one can be filed away in the back of my mind like on ft sia
A lot of rap is just very honest thought. Especially Jcoles. As a long time fan of his he has a lot of thoughts and ideas in his music that i don’t agree with and don’t condone. But the thing is that’s it’s not to be taken personally. It’s someone’s personal thought. For me it doesn’t necessarily mean that he is insulting every athiest but it’s a form of expression/exaggeration of the idea.
BTS and kpop and a lot of khh too gives us extremely sanitised music which doesn’t offend anyone or is not too controversial (which is why a lot of people prefer it as well) which is okay .To each his own.
I’m not saying you should be okay because obviously as a consumer or art you should view it through your own mind and values.
But personally as a fan to me i was delighted that he didn’t censor his art just because this song was for a different artist and just spoke honestly even if it wasn’t something everyone will accept or agree with. because too often i see western artists tone down and santise their work when collabing with BTS.
I‘ve only listened to it a couple of times so far because I was busy, but when I read the lyrics for the first time I was a bit taken aback as well. I‘m also someone who can get pretty heated when people try to force their beliefs on others or look down on people with different beliefs, especially when it’s religious beliefs.
Honestly, I‘m not familiar with J. Cole, so I don’t know how his music and verses usually sound. I generally think if he wants to say that then he can say it, but it does irk me as well, especially in the context of this song. It just feels like it doesn’t really fit the meaning and the thoughts behind it.
I do really like the vibe of the song though, so I guess I‘ll just listen to it without thinking too much about his lyrics in that part, but I can absolutely understand why it gives you complicated feelings and why you might be disappointed! So if it doesn’t sit right with you, then it’s totally ok to not want to support it that much.
As a hip hop head and a J Cole fan, this didn’t surprise me at all. His (inarguably his contemporary) and Kendrick’s raps have been laced with themes of God and faith since the beginning of time.
Especially Cole is known for his honest lyricism more than anything else. He’s known to be an artist who brings “hope” with his words and music. I think anyone who is familiar with his work (including Hobi) wasn’t expecting anything else.
With Cole’s retirement talk coming about, I think he used this song as a platform to bring back the themes he’s most familiar with.
I mean if the themes were reversed there will be uproar too. So, I think in this instance I’m just enjoying the music for what it is; just an absolute GOAT collaborating with one my favourite artists who had similar upbringings.
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i’m with you OP, i was totally vibing with the song until the god stuff. it totally took me out and i couldn’t enjoy the rest of the song and i hate that i have to even say that because i was truly so excited. i’m so happy for hobi that he got to work with his idol, beyond happy, but the result is not for me and i won’t be listening to this version again.
idk i just could never imagine calling people stupid for not believing in god on someone’s last song before they have to enlist in the military. imo it just seems in poor taste??
oh well, ~~thankfully~~ hopefully there’s the hobi only version to look forward to.
As someone who was used to rap full of swear words, people dissing each other and references to sex, drugs, money and power (before encountering BTS), I was pleasantly surprised to hear this part of the lyrics. Still, thanks for sharing your thoughts. I learned something new about how it might sound to nonbelievers.
OP I‘m with you. I felt the exact same thing, it took me completely out of the song.
I was a bit afraid to post it in a bts sub (also didn’t want to spoil the mood) so I made a comment on the main kpop sub. But it feels like there is a good portion of people who feel the same.
I read all the arguments that he’s honest and raw.. but I really thought this was a song for fans (of Hobi), a goodbye song, meant to bring comfort.. and his line was making me really uncomfortable, it felt out of place. Nothing that brings comfort.
But there probably will be a Hobi only version so we can definitely look forward to that (I personally love every other aspect of the song).
But it’s nice to see that people can discuss this topic and be really civil. That doesn’t happen often with topics like this
swearing is not a problem to me at all. a lot of rappers i listen to also mention their faith, which again, is not a problem to me either. calling someone stupid for having a different belief is the abrasive part for me. i’m not someone who listens to jcole regularly so this one song isn’t that big of a deal for me, i still enjoy his flow and tone during his verse.
if it’s any consolation op, there seems to be a fully hobi version to be released so at least there’s a different option for you to still support him if you’d like. 💜
I made a short comment on this yesterday in the kpop sub, I’ll post it here for you as well. It’s so hard for me to have any negative feelings about something related to Hobi because I love him so much. I’m honestly crying a bit again just typing this (sorry to be dramatic 😂)
I truly don’t mind people expressing their spiritual beliefs in their art when it doesn’t impose on others, but the “stupid as hell” _for me_ doesn’t fit with Hobi and his own message (hello Equal Sign “no one is above anyone else, and no one is below anyone else”).
I’m still appreciating the rest of the song and focusing on how happy and proud I am for Hobi to work with his muse and how far he’s come! I love the dancing, Hobi’s lyrics, the beat, the whole look and style, etc. (edit: and I personally still think J.Cole’s verse overall sounds amazing)
>the song is so meaningful and emotional for me, and then there’s suddenly that line. It’s not really that I’m offended, I just wish it wasn’t there. I don’t love being reminded of my religious trauma in the middle of this special song.
I don’t mean to try and convince other people to feel negatively if they don’t. But it’s at least good to not feel lonely in your disappointment, because I felt that yesterday and it was helpful to see that I’m not alone.
Lifelong, ardent atheist here. I have no problem with artists who profess their faith. I’ve got a few Christian songs in my playlists because they’re good songs and very often you can interpret the lyrics in a completely secular way (“Flood” by Jars of Clay is great example of this.) But I do take issue with professing your faith at the expense of others and that’s what bugs me here.
It took me a couple of listens to pay attention to the lyrics because I’m more interested in the overall vibe of the music. Honestly, if the music doesn’t grab me, I don’t really care how great the lyrics are. I might as well read a poem. So I was really enjoying the song, checked out the lyrics and definitely got brought up short by THAT verse. I don’t know much, or anything really, about J. Cole, other than how he relates to BTS. But in checking him out I’ve seen numerous comments about his “honest” lyrics and I respect that. If he believes that us non-believers are stupid, you do you dude. But know your audience. I’d guess that a pretty large segment of BTS’s fan base isn’t familiar with J. Cole. Not to generalize because I know there’s a lot of fandom crossover, but ARMY probably isn’t your typical J. Cole fan. We know what he means to Hobi though and we know “On the Street” is Hobi’s goodbye-for-now song to Army. So this is neither the right vehicle nor the right time for this particular take of Cole’s. But even if he wanted to be honest about his beliefs, which would be perfectly fine, it’s 100% possible to do so without calling others stupid. Know. Your. Audience. I wouldn’t say I’m offended since I’ve been called worse for my non-belief; its more like I’m annoyed at his lack of awareness.
I love Hobi and I do love the vibe of the song and the overall meaning—and while I wish there was more of a balance, I get why he gave the lion’s share of the verses to his idol—so I’ll do everything I can to support him. I’ve also started checking out J. Cole too and so far, I like what I’ve heard so maybe I should just take the music at face value and not look too deeply into the lyrics.
I feel ya, OP. I didn’t realize the lyrics at first until afterwards, and you’re not the only army I’ve seen bring it up, so I thought it was interesting that HYBE let it slide, including the N word.
I liked the song, but Cole’s part took me out of it, not so much because of the lyrics, but because of his rapping just didn’t match the beat of the song, and that made it cacophonous for me.
Edit: On a total opposite note, one of my friends who’s a devout Christian and J Cole fan announced very loudly that she was canceling him because his first two lines were akin to Satan worship. So that was… A new take
Thank you for creating this thread. I feel the same way, and ended up commenting a longer comment on one of the other subs this morning. Someone didn’t understand why people were offended, and I explained, and someone said that wasn’t what he meant in the lyrics, so I posted a longer response.
I am so glad to see other people have an emotional response like I did. I legit cried last night. As someone else pointed out, those of us who are atheist often have religious trauma. I live in the Bible Belt. It sucks. This was meant to be a song for ARMY, but now I feel like I’m excluded, and that hurts. Like, why was this even allowed in this song? I listened once and can’t listen again. I love Hobi, but this feels like this song wasn’t for me.
I look forward to the J-Hope only version.
I’m with you on this. Whenever I’m listening to music and an artist brings up religion I’m side eyeing and rolling my eyes.
I like the song but bible stuff puts me off.
I can agree with this, and at the same time love the song because it’s Hobi. I really sort of feel neutral about Cole’s verse overall, but that particular line made me feel a lot of things. While not an atheist, I (and my husband) left the church in 2018 because the hypocrisy (and alignment with the alt right) was not something we could stomach. We’re both deconstructing and trying to figure out exactly what each of us believes.
I’m older than most ARMY, and l think that might influence some of my feelings here, but anyway … I say exactly what I mean, so I tend to assume others are doing the same. Cole didn’t specifically say that everyone who doesn’t believe in God is stupid; just his “friend.” He could very well be insulting every single listener who doesn’t share his faith, but I’m not inside his head, so I can’t presume to know what he means either way. I definitely wish it wasn’t there, and it’s strange juxtaposed against Hobi’s message of “love, always, for us,” especially, as was pointed out upthread, after Equal Sign.
But it’s Hobi, and I never had a choice when he made himself my ult 😂. I’m happy for him for having had the chance to work with his idol. I adore his lyrics, the whistle, his dancing. The harkening back to Danger tugs especially hard at my heartstrings, as does the fact that this is his “farewell for now” to ARMY. I very much look forward to the hope-only version.
I don’t think having mixed feelings, or having a distaste for on the street, is being dramatic at all. 💜
OP, thanks for your bravery in posting. I support you in having your own take, and I hope my offering a different perspective is okay. For context, I grew up non-Christian in the American rural south, at a time when that made me and my family stick out like sore thumbs. “You’re not Christian” was inevitably in the background of many extended social gatherings outside of the music and arts circles my parents were part of, and sometimes even within those circles. I spent most of my (long ago) young adulthood getting the chip off my shoulder about my religious orientation, accepting myself for who I am and not feeling defensive or provoked by others. (Okay, that chip is still there is some political contexts, but in a very different way.)
All that to say: Hoseok is a serious, longtime student of rap and has a specific personal connection with J Cole’s music going back to his youth. He is a grown man and an extraordinary, seasoned artist, and someone who clearly respects difference and equality. Whatever Hoseok’s personal religious beliefs may be, I can totally see how he would be excited to collaborate with one of his heroes and let that person be his authentic self in the collaboration. And I can be excited for Hoseok to have what probably felt like a highlight of his lifetime thus far. And I can do all that without necessarily personally agreeing with all of what I think I hear in J Cole’s lyrics. I’m not saying that anyone has to love the song (although I do) or have any specific reaction to it. I *am* saying that more than one thing can be true at once, and just maybe there is space for generosity here, towards Hobi and J Cole.
Love to you all and thanks yet again for this treasured space.
For everyone upset that J Cole’s verse doesn’t represent the version of jhope that we think we know, I just want to point out that Hoseok is obviously okay with it and wanted to release it.
Above all, I want to respect him as an artist and trust in his choices.
Hobi is one of my biases in BTS and when I heard about the collab with J.Cole I was genuinely really happy for him because I know how much he looks up to him!
Having said that, I honestly don’t know anything about J.Cole or his music so I had no idea what kind of expectations to have about the song.
I don’t really mind swearing in songs although I guess it kinda depends on how it’s used.
But yeah when it came to J.Cole’s verse I was immediately put off, I thought it was kinda funny too in a way that he calls non-believers stupid as hell if we can’t prove that God isn’t real but in that logic all believers are stupid as hell too since they can’t prove God is real.
I wished I could love the song the way I had wanted to but it’s just gonna be another one of those “I’ll forget it exists” collabs.
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i totally missed that line. i was vibing then he threw in the n word. like, i listen to a TON of hip hop, but a bts song is the LAST place i would expect to hear it. i’m not saying its good or bad, but it was jarring and definitely took me out. now, as a fellow atheist, i’m not really thrilled to see this. i’m sure i’ve listened to other songs with similar sentiments but they are definitely NOT bts songs or from any of the members. 🫤
I want to add that I love the boys. They have helped me get through some very difficult times and they mean a heck of a lot to me. But, I won’t support them just for the sake of supporting. I won’t cheer them on if it’s something that I stand against on. So far, their global message has been on mental health and mainly loving yourself. It’s empowering to shout out loud “I’m learning how to love my self”. But it’s different if it puts someone else down.
I want to thank everyone who joined this discussion to share how they feel about the song regardless of where you stand in this argument(?) and giving me and many others a safe space to discuss things in a very civil way.
Hi, I wanted to say I appreciate your rant because your interpretation and perspective is something I often overlook when I encounter art with themes I disagree with, like characterizing non-believers as stupid. I somehow managed to grow up as a very independently-minded person in a strongly conservative community, so my ingrained reaction to expressions that imply I am lacking because of a particular belief usually have me saying, “Ok, well, I disagree with you, but we can obviously coexist because we’re doing it right now.” And I still forget that not everyone reacts this way; that expressions like this can give people pain, reopen unhealed trauma, and actually convince people that they are lacking because of their personal beliefs. The internet can be a difficult place to share this vulnerability, and I appreciate that you and others here have chosen to do so. It’s meaningful to me, and I feel like a slightly better, more empathetic person because of it.
And because I’m such a fucking nerd about art, I also appreciate the lyrics Cole wrote that brought this opportunity, and Hobi’s offering a feature on this song, which gives it a platform for people to encounter it that otherwise might not have. Because of this, you’ve connected with art and shared that connection with others (like me), and made this art more brilliant than it was on its own. There are lots of philosophies of what art is, but I feel strongly that artistic works aren’t complete until people engage with them, which is exactly what you’ve done. I understand from what you’ve said here that your experience, your engagement is painful, but I also think that it’s beautiful and the way it makes this work whole makes the world better. Thank you for sharing it with us.
I understand your point of view, and you shouldn’t feel pressured to change the reaction you had to the song since it’s your feelings – and no one can tell you what to feel.
With the swearing – as someone who listens to rap a lot I really just brush over it. I can definitely understand though that it can be jarring for some ARMY who aren’t used to it in the guys’ music.
I initially also thought the ‘stupid as hell’ verse was directed to his friend, since that seems like something you’d say to someone you were very close to, and the full verse is ‘I got a friend smart as fuck, but he stupid as hell/He swear that God ain’t real’. If it provides any comfort to you, it doesn’t seem like Jcole is calling everyone who doesn’t believe in religion as stupid.
Im so glad I wasnt the only one put off by that, swearing i can get past but religion is a whole other thing. I thought I was being ridiculous cuz i hadnt seen anyone talk about it
The lyrics message from each artist was missing a connection for me. That was the most confusing issue & dampened maybe Hobi s intent for his sweet good bye gift to ARMY with this release.
I didn’t know where to share my thoughts & glad I found here.
If it was a collab between the 2 usually there’s a message connection /lyric flow I couldn’t find it.(im no music expert)
I was not offended re what the 2 artists lyrics were but am repeating myself the 2 seemed to go in different directions with the lyric or message conveyed.
I liked the tune the whistling the rap styles & the mv but maybe a collab with J Cole/JHope separate from JHope’s good bye army song would have made more sense.
J Hope is extremely talented, he’s an Aquarius like my sister very hard working driven & bit mysterious but good hearted people. He has a chunk of my heart like all 7.
I respect his collab choice with J Cole (hobi think was tickled pink to work with him & probably gave him bit free reign with his lyrics). Many of us would do the same if it was someone we looked up to & got the chance to work with. I got this off my chest so i can now stre4m & support
J Hope’s 💜 gift.
That part did kind of throw me off too, otherwise I did like his verse. It’s interesting because J-Hope’s verse could also sound religious if you don’t know that he’s talking about Army and interpret the “you” that he’s talking to as…not Army. If you have no context for the song, then the overall vibe and that verse could come across like that. To that end, I think J.Cole’s verse actually went really well with his theme-wise — they are both thankful to something else that they have a lot of faith in, without whom their career wouldn’t really exist, and who drives them forward.
So that is why I actually found his verse cohesive with the rest of the song. But that one line is very…I don’t know. It did take me out of it for a bit and I get why it would rub a lot of people the wrong way. It does feel a bit like forcing faith on someone — if you don’t believe this, you are stupid, even though it can’t be proven. J-Hope would’ve approved of the verse (since it’s his song) but I wonder about it. (It’s also interesting that J.Cole’s verse is so long and J-Hope’s is so short when the song itself is meant to comfort Army because of J-Hope’s pending enlistment… I have nothing against it normally but for the purpose of the song makes me feel like it should’ve been the other way around.)
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